PATRICIA KARVELAS: Prime Minister Anthony Albanese says he had a warm and constructive conversation with the US President Donald Trump overnight. And the readout of the phone call says they discussed cooperation over critical minerals. To unpack that and a couple of other issues too, the Resources Minister Madeleine King joins me now. Welcome to the program.

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: It's good to be with you again, Patricia. It's been a long time.

PATRICIA KARVELAS: Well, good. Come more often. Now, the readout from the Prime Minister's phone call with Donald Trump overnight said they did discuss cooperating on critical minerals and economic opportunities. Is there a new offer on the table?

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: To be honest, we've always had the same offer, and it goes to the US and it goes to other countries that are interested in investing in our critical minerals resources, and that's that we are a trusted supplier. We have a unique geology. We have the world's best resources sector. And I mean that in every sense of the word. From the minerals we can extract, the processing we're facilitating right now, the refining we see in our future with a lot of government and private investment. So, you know, we encourage US investment in these products. We need them for our green future, but also for our defence applications. But equally, the US needs them for their secure supply chains as well.

PATRICIA KARVELAS: You've wanted to negotiate exemptions to US tariffs on imports, including the 50 per cent tariff on aluminium and steel. Just to be clear, is critical minerals in exchange for a lower tariff on that?

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: No, critical minerals sits on its own. It is one of our great national assets, a gift of our geology. We are in the best place in the world to be able to mine and refine those commodities. There's no swap on these things. There's part of an overall, I suppose, approach that we put to the US to demonstrate our value to them. And as the Trade Minister has often said, you know, the terms of trade with the US generally benefit the US because Australia buys more of their things than we buy, than they buy of ours. But equally, we have  extraordinary superannuation investments that go directly into American businesses. So, it's not just about critical minerals, it's about a whole raft of things. But we do think that in heavy rare earths and rare earths more generally, and critical minerals, there's an excellent opportunity for us to work together.

PATRICIA KARVELAS: You say "it sits on its own", but it hasn't always sat on its own, Minister, with respect. It was being offered as part of a deal to try and get a lower tariff. You're saying that's no longer the way you're negotiating on this?

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Well, I think what we've seen out of the US Administration, they've been very firm and very clear on their tariff position. You know, we disagree with that position and would say, and it indeed is, it's just a penalty for their own economy and on their consumers. But I don't think we can, you know, get too caught up in trying to turn the tide on that. What we need to do is keep talking really positively about how we can contribute to their future considerations of those tariffs but move ahead with other things we can do together in a really positive sense.

PATRICIA KARVELAS: Okay, so this is standalone, not about tariffs anymore. Does that mean that you've kind of wave the white flag on tariffs?

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: No, no. Well, I mean, I would say of course we would welcome any change.

PATRICIA KARVELAS: But you're not, you're not pushing hard for it. You think that's an unlikely outcome now?

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: I think it's unlikely, but there's more at stake. The ten per cent tariffs are a negative thing, there's no doubt about it. It's not good for our local industries, it's not good for BlueScope and others and we would rather they weren't there as a general principle and we'll always continue to fight for that. But we really need to think about how can best move into the future in our relationship with the US in developing these rare earth supply chains because it's a really tall order to establish this industry. We saw a really very significant moment a few weeks ago when the US Department of Defense invested a significant amount of money in introducing a floor price into a light rare earths mine in the US called Mountain Pass. So, we want to work with them on how we might have a similar system or they might invest in US strategic reserve to make sure we lift all boats on that tide so we can create that rare earth industry that the world needs to have a diversified supply chain.

PATRICIA KARVELAS: So, you're looking at a floor price for our industry as well.

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: We're looking at a range of things through the critical mineral strategic reserve offtake agreements. A floor price may be part of that, a stockpile of sorts. And all of these things can work together to introduce stability into a market that is subject to intensive manipulation. It's very opaque. It is, you know, it's very low volume. It's quite the opposite of the current resources industry, which is a backbone of our economy. As your viewers would realise, iron ore and coal are extraordinarily vast commodities, and these things are much, much smaller. So, they're much more susceptible to manipulation.

PATRICIA KARVELAS: Look, that's obviously been an ongoing issue, us trying to do some deal around minerals. You'd previously said that if the United States isn't interested in our critical minerals, we will look elsewhere. So, have you ascertained now that they are definitely interested after this phone call with Donald Trump?

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Well, I mean our resources are not, you know, exclusive to anybody, any other country. So, we already have investment from credit agencies of the government of Japan, of the Republic of Korea. We have lots of interest and are talking actively with members of the European Union, individual countries, as well as the European Union itself. So, there's a lot going on in this space. And whilst we would always want to do more work with the US, and I think it's more than just thinking about it like a deal, like it's a swap or I think it's a bit more complex than that, it's like it's a whole lot of interactions that need to come together in a pretty orderly fashion. And the G7 reflected on this too when they announced their Critical Minerals Action Plan earlier in the year. So, all manner of countries are interested in our rare earths and they're already investing. It's how we make sure we use our existing and long-term and very stable relationship with the United States to make sure their investment is solid as well.

PATRICIA KARVELAS: And the phone call with the US President is obviously important. Does that mean we're closer to an actual face to face meeting?

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Oh, well, there's been a number of phone calls and I know there will be a meeting in due course. I imagine every day I guess it's closer, isn't it?

PATRICIA KARVELAS: So, inevitably, by the entire concept of the way time works. We're very deep here on this Friday afternoon. But are we actually closer to nailing a date and a time?

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Well, we would expect so. And indeed, you know, there was a meeting set before, but you know, extraordinary global events intervened and I think everyone understands why that had to change. The really important thing is there's been a succession of very constructive phone calls with the Prime Minister and the President. And aside from that, there's also interaction by many officials, certainly officials from my department, but also of course, Ambassador Rudd, as well as other Ministers. There's a lot of conversations going on and they're really very active and very engaged. So, I have no doubt that meeting will happen, but it will be off the back of a number of close phone calls and other interactions with the US Administration.

PATRICIA KARVELAS: Minister, is the Albanese Government close to dumping or changing your superannuation promise that you took to the election?

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: There are no changes to superannuation policies as announced. They've been made known publicly for over two years. So, no, there is no change to them.

PATRICIA KARVELAS: There's no change. So, you still, just to be clear about what that means, that tax - the increased tax on super balances of more than 3 million, that's still to go ahead.

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: That, that is going ahead as planned. And that is, that will apply to about, you know, half a percent of all superannuation holders, yes.

PATRICIA KARVELAS: So, what do you make of reporting that it's about to be paused or dumped?

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Well, I can't guess how that reporting comes about. Well, I guess, I suppose I could guess, but I don't think that reporting is entirely correct. Our policies remain the same.

PATRICIA KARVELAS: Which bit isn't? Which bit is correct then?

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Well, that our policy - well, not the reporting, as I have said, our policies have not changed. The superannuation changes as announced on the balances over $3 million at this moment are still intended to go ahead.

PATRICIA KARVELAS: Okay, at this moment I'm just going to pick up—

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Well, as far as I'm aware that hasn't changed.

PATRICIA KARVELAS: Cabinet hasn't made a decision to pause or dump it?

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Well, I'm not going to talk about Cabinet discussions, as you would understand, but there is no change to our policy. I'm sorry to sound repetitive.

PATRICIA KARVELAS: No, it's all right. Well, I asked in five different ways, which is—

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: I know, and you did very well, thank you.

PATRICIA KARVELAS: --which is how I live. Just finally, something that pertains to your Resources portfolio. Obviously, the climate target will be announced in September next month. A 2035 climate target, north of 60 per cent will require more than $400 billion in new capital investment from the government and industry. That's according to modelling from the Business Council. Does that number concern you?

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Well, I think the input from the Business Council as from others, is welcome. It's a very good thing that there are a lot of voices in this debate and contributing to it, and no doubt many of us will all read that a bit more detail in coming days. Obviously, the government does its own modelling and we have our own research which gets shared in due course. But I think the main thing for the community at large to be really reassured by is this government is committed to reaching net zero. We're committed to reaching our emissions targets. We will set a new target. And this is all because we do need to take action on climate change. We know we have greenhouse gases need to be arrested so that we can, you know, maintain the planet. So, it's a very important driver of this government. We've enacted legislation and we're committed to that promise because we believe in the science of climate change, which is quite unlike the Coalition at this moment that seems a bit confused on that point.

PATRICIA KARVELAS: Madeleine King, Minister, thank you so much for joining us. Come again, please.

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Yes, thanks, Patricia. And I have to say, go Freo for the weekend.

PATRICIA KARVELAS: Okay, fair enough. Well, Collingwood won last night, so I'm done for the weekend. I'm fine, thank you very much.

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: See you later.