NADIA MITSOPOULOS: Well, you've been repeatedly told recently that if governments break election promises, they have to tell you why. And right now, that job, to all of you listening, goes to the Federal Resources Minister, Madeleine King, who's with me now. Good morning, Minister.

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Good morning, Nadia. How are you this morning?

NADIA MITSOPOULOS: Yeah, I'm well, thank you. Now, this was Anthony Albanese being questioned on the campaign trail last year:

[EXCERPT]

SPEAKER: Can you rule out any changes to negative gearing and capital gains tax?

PRIME MINISTER ANTHONY ALBANESE: Yes. How hard is it? For the 50th time.

[EXCERPT ENDS]

NADIA MITSOPOULOS: That was pretty clear cut, Minister, do you regret breaking that promise?

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Nadia I think it's really important for everyone to understand that a government sees evidence before us, you know, over the years since the election, and when you see that evidence and the weight of it, you do need to think about what's best in the national interest. And if that means a government has to change its position, as we have changed our position, then that's one of those hard decisions and the hard path we have to tread. But we do it in the national interest. And importantly, on these decisions, we do it with the future generations in mind so that they are able to enjoy the property ownership that many of us, older people over 50, that we get to enjoy right now.

So, I understand some people won't be happy with this decision that we've made, this hard decision that we've made, but I believe it is the right thing to do to ensure we build up that intergenerational equity. And really importantly, of course, there is a grandfathering position of the arrangement, so if you do have existing investments, they'll remain. But importantly, negative gearing is still able to be pursued by people who want to invest in properties. And these changes are about harnessing that Australian drive to invest in property in the national interest, but really importantly, in the interests of younger generations of Australia. So, the new measures will encourage that new investment, encourage it into new builds, which builds up housing stock. And we all know, we've all seen the reports of how short we are of housing in this country. So, I think it's an important change based on evidence that the Government has seen, and I think it proves to your listeners that we are listening, we are listening to people's concerns.

NADIA MITSOPOULOS: Well, you can tell me if you think the Government's got this one right. 1300 22 1025. A couple of things to ask about, but it does question the integrity, and I guess you could argue, well, why would anyone believe what you say in the future?

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Well, as I said, we see evidence as we work in government through the various avenues that we have. And when you look back at things and realise that when the capital gains discount first came in in 1999 under the Howard government, since that time house prices increased by more than 400 per cent. While wages have gone up, it's not nearly to that kind of rate. So, things have become unaffordable and for younger people that are trying to break into this market, it's really difficult. And the Government has made a decision that they shouldn't have to wait another two years and another round to have access to what us as older people have had access to or been able to break into through the property market.

NADIA MITSOPOULOS: Ok. But how does it address intergenerational inequality if you're locking in tax breaks for people who've already got access to them and then winding them back for new players, doesn't that just create a two-tiered system?

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: No, indeed. And there will be a different system as we do have these grandfathering provisions. But what we have seen as well is that often people become positively geared after a number of years or they indeed sell those properties as prices go up. So, that's an important part of the whole planning around this. It will put more building stock into the market. That is what's really important. That's important for new buyers of property also, of course, renters and rental affordability. It's a way of harnessing investment powers into this new stock of housing for future generations.

NADIA MITSOPOULOS: Now, one common thread that's coming through on the text line since we started talking, Minister, is you're resisting calls for a new 25 per cent tax on gas exports. Now the Australia Institute is saying that could have raised more than $17 billion a year and then you have people like the former Treasury Secretary Ken Henry, who said this last month:

[EXCERPT]

KEN HENRY: Just do it. In the national interest, just do it and stop the crap that the Australian public have put up with for decades now.

[EXCERPT ENDS]

NADIA MITSOPOULOS: So, why aren't you listening to the guy who got us through the global financial crisis, Minister?

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: I think, and I've said this before in many fora, is that we should think about how we have a gas industry in this country. Like, it is built upon hundreds of billions of dollars of investment, and without that investment we wouldn't have the benefit of the domestic gas reservation that we do in Western Australia, which enables lots of advanced manufacturing to happen in this state as well as there being affordable gas. Obviously, and I've said this before as well, the Petroleum Resource Rent Tax is a profits-based tax and indeed it has returned and increased margin.

NADIA MITSOPOULOS: Not enough profits, Minister. That's the criticism, not – you get more from beer, Minister. You get more from beer.

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: That is not true, Nadia. And that is some spin that the Australia Institute has really taken upon itself to spin into institutions right around the country, such as media players like yourselves. And it's been taken up with great gusto, with little or zero critical thought applied to the figures they produce. And I would urge those that want to push the Australia Institute argument to dig a little bit deeper into what it is they're trying to do. And it's not about raising revenue at all. And they've been very clear about this. The Australia Institute and senators from Canberra, a very long way away from the jobs the LNG industry provides to Western Australians. They just want the gas industry to end, Nadia. They don't really care for regional security or prosperity. They just want there to be no gas in this country. Now, I am committed to net zero ambitions for this country. I'm part of a government that legislated for this. So, we just need to do it in an orderly fashion. And as I've pointed out in the Future Gas Strategy that this government published a couple of years ago, we need to have gas in the system to firm renewables or else renewables don't work. So, this is a really complex ecosystem that cannot be thought to or promoted to be destroyed by institutions, by the Australia Institute, that quite frankly have very little idea about how the Western Australian economy works. And they don't want to know, Nadia. And I think it's really, it's not fair on the West Australian people that this rubbish gets promoted all the time.

NADIA MITSOPOULOS: I don't think it's an argument that's going to go away anytime soon. Two other issues if I can just touch on with you, Minister. Madeleine King, the Federal Resources Minister and member for Brand, is my guest this morning. We'll get to news headlines in a moment. Your government finally tabled its response to the Murphy Report into online gambling on the day of the federal Budget while all the journalists were in the budget lockup. Why did you bury it on a busy news day? Because that's what you did. That's what the government did. And it's naughty.

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: I do think the media puts more credit into conspiracy theories about –

NADIA MITSOPOULOS: No, no, no, we know how it works, Minister.

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Well, I know how it works too, working in it. And everyone thinks there's conspiracies, but there's not there's just a lot to do all the time in government is actually the truth of it. We should not – I don't see why government – I don't think any Western Australian listening today would think the Australian Government should stop doing its other work that it does every single day because of the Budget. We have to keep that work going while we do a Budget. We do have to do more than one or two or three or four or five things all the time in government because that's our job.

NADIA MITSOPOULOS: You've had a thousand days. You've had a thousand days.

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: I understand why you – and people say that about a lot of things. But if, I mean, if only we could be that coordinated. I just think, I think you rank us too highly on [indistinct].

NADIA MITSOPOULOS: I reckon we're going to agree to disagree. My final question is a serious one. The Federal Court yesterday awarded the Yindjibarndi people $150 million of compensation after Fortescue mined their lands for years without their permission. Now, Elders have described that as peanuts. They wanted closer to $2 billion. Do you agree with this decision and what they got?

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Look, I won't go into the figures, but I do, I agree with the process, certainly through the Federal Court. I think it's a really important principle that the Federal Court has established that Fortescue should not have gone and done those things without permission. And the First Nations owners have waged quite a remarkable battle. And I totally support them pursuing their rights in this regard. And I also support them in wanting to seek to challenge that if indeed that's what they do on the dollar figure. Equally, you know, as part of one of the arms of government, you know, I respect the work of the Federal Court. But really importantly, mining companies like Fortescue need to engage with their First Nations and Indigenous owners who have native title over these mining areas, because that's how, you know, the mining industry and First Nations communities can work together collaboratively. Trying to run [indistinct] over Traditional Owners is just totally unacceptable and no one should accept it. And good on them for challenging this. And I look forward to seeing what happens next in this case.

NADIA MITSOPOULOS: All right, I'll leave it there. Madeleine King, thank you very much for your time.

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: No worries. Thank you, Nadia. Thanks. Good to be on board.

NADIA MITSOPOULOS: She's the Federal Resources Minister and Member for Brand.